Baker Lake Harsh Wardens

[Matt]

You would be right, FF. We run at least one 50/50 at all times. Stopped in at Cabelas today on my way home from work, the ENTIRE dodger section is wiped clean. If anyone is still in the market, and needs a quick last minute one I would hate to say it but "cough cough" Wal-mart has the chrome Luhr Jensens. People don't seem to "think" of them, so they usually keep a good selection after other shops are picked clean. Luckily I started stocking up for Baker one piece at a time beginning back in December and am completely ready for this season and likely several more .

In regards to being followed around all day. It is common at Baker for the small boats, kayaks, rafts, etc to be targeted by the authorities. They are frequently the ones who don't carry the proper safety gear, and are also the most susceptible to the elements. Not saying it is "right" but that's how it is. Ask Natetreat, he was up there in his Kayak with his Pa last year, and the Sheriff rolled right past Rseas and myself and be-lined straight for them to check for safety gear.

We will be out again Sunday O-Dark-30. See E V E R Y O N E on the water.... lol.

[RiverChromeGS]

thanks for pointing the 3 fish limit out, Bodo. i had thought that he was "Fishin' for the boat" your point is well said.

yea, i didnt have my limit on my card, i had 2 on my card, but because i fought the fish for the majority ONLY because my partner also had one on, he said it should have gone on my card, but SHOW me in the rule book where it specifies who's card it goes on. Is it whos pole it bites on, who hooks it, who holds the rod when the fish in netted? It doesnt say!, the warden was puzzled also but decided to make up his own rule saying because i fought the majority of the fish that it was "mine".

thats not gonna hold up in court, if I show the judge my 2 fish on my card, and tell him that I was only holding and reeling because my buddy was busy with another fish, and my buddy initially had fought the fish and set the hook, and TO ME the rod that gets bit is the guy who marks it, then its simply not going to hold up.

bordeau- as far as the following me, he followed me for the better part of 2 hours, asking questions about gear, where i live, college, ect... WTF!! And the kids thing, i would imagine they have some lenience with kids because they cant always reel their own fish in, so i guess his made up rule applies to people old enough to hold a rod? like you said, great job WDFW, i wouldnt be surprised if they WOULD give you s**t if not a ticket for having your unlicensed wife hold the rod, they came across like the kind of guys that just dont give a s**t. i would honestly be careful, you never know after what happened to me...

If it specified in the rule book what the guidelines for marking fish in regard to who set the hook/fought it then fine, ill pay the ticket, but since it doesnt, it will not hold up, because i only had 2 fish on my card. Or does it say somewhere? The warden HIMSELF said its not in the book, so he made up the "majority" thing to give me a ticket. Personally, i believe the person who hooked the fish on their rod is more responsible for the fish that the person who simply reels it to the net, but then again its OK to hand off and fight it, then mark your card, theres simply no rule that specifies...

Quad- thats what im most angry about, im not saying i absolutely didnt break the law, althought technicially theres no rule against what i did since the fish came on my buddies rod and i simply reeled it in. But still, i see why he gave me the ticket, but following me for 2 hours instead of doing something useful like checking boats at the launch or being somewhere MORE important than baker lake where the fish are meant to be caught and killed, all that for a "boat" fishing ticket and i didnt even have 3 fish on my card? Theres much more pressing and important issues out there, waste of our tax money IMO to pay those wardens to do that, he checked me and only me for those 2 hours... stupid

[Matt]

I think you deserved what you got. I hate nothing more than seeing guys on the river handing fish off to others so they can punch it.

To clarify. It is NOT against the law to hand your rod off, and then have your partner punch the fish. The key in the definition is they have to have fought the fish for the "majority" of the fight.

[RiverChromeGS]

You would be right, FF. We run at least one 50/50 at all times. Stopped in at Cabelas today on my way home from work, the ENTIRE dodger section is wiped clean. If anyone is still in the market, and needs a quick last minute one I would hate to say it but "cough cough" Wal-mart has the chrome Luhr Jensens. People don't seem to "think" of them, so they usually keep a good selection after other shops are picked clean. Luckily I started stocking up for Baker one piece at a time beginning back in December and am completely ready for this season and likely several more .

In regards to being followed around all day. It is common at Baker for the small boats, kayaks, rafts, etc to be targeted by the authorities. They are frequently the ones who don't carry the proper safety gear, and are also the most susceptible to the elements. Not saying it is "right" but that's how it is. Ask Natetreat, he was up there in his Kayak with his Pa last year, and the Sheriff rolled right past Rseas and myself and be-lined straight for them to check for safety gear.

We will be out again Sunday O-Dark-30. See E V E R Y O N E on the water.... lol.

most likely will be on the lake sunday also,

In regards to dodgers, i hate to do it also because i dont quite have all the ones i like, but Holiday market one exit south of the cook road exit to head to baker has EVERY dodger you could possibly need as of this afternoon

[RiverChromeGS]

also holiday just got new sand shrimp!

[Mike Carey]

we'll be out there next Monday. This is a good reminder thread. Here's a question though:

If you have a two rod endorsement and you have one fish left to catch, do you have to only use one rod? Because last year, my wife and I each had a fish to go, and were running 3 rods (we each had the two rod endorsement). Naturally, we hit a triple. So now we have reeled in our limits and there is one fish swimming around with a hook in it's mouth. So to keep legal, would you not net it and cut the leader? We released at the boat, never netted it, never put it in the boat.

Opinions?

[RiverChromeGS]

Your fine fishing 2 rods even with one fish to go, there isnt a law against that, good luck, i might be there monday too mike! not sure tho, shout hello if ya see us, ill do the same!

[Mike Carey]

Your fine fishing 2 rods even with one fish to go, there isnt a law against that, good luck, i might be there monday too mike! not sure tho, shout hello if ya see us, ill do the same!

Will do, but forgive me if I'm busy juggling four rods and don't notice.

I'm like a kid waiting for his birthday. I have to work this weekend and then we are outta here!

I'll be glad when Aaron is able to get the phone app done, it will have a feature allowing members to find each other on the lakes/rivers/saltwater if they choose.

[hewesfisher]

So to keep legal, would you not net it and cut the leader? We released at the boat, never netted it, never put it in the boat. Opinions?

Releasing at the boat, not netting, and never putting in the boat was the most correct, and legal, thing to do.
Rules pamphlet, pg 13:

SALMON and TROUT HANDLING RULES
FRESHWATER: “It is unlawful to totally remove salmon, steelhead, or Dolly Varden/Bull Trout from the water if it is unlawful to retain those fish, or if the angler subsequently releases the salmon, steelhead, Dolly Varden/Bull Trout.”

MARINE AREAS 5 through 13: “It is unlawful to bring wild salmon or a species of salmon aboard a vessel if it is unlawful to
retain that salmon” (“aboard” means inside the gunwale of a vessel).

MARINE AREA 2-2: “It is unlawful to totally remove salmon from the water if it is illegal to retain those fish, except anglers fishing from boats 30 feet or longer as listed on either their state or Coast Guard registration, are exempt.”

How to release fish from the same page:

When you need to release a fish, there are some special precautions you can take to give it the best chance of surviving:
· Minimize handling by leaving the fish in the water.
· Do not net your fish – but if you must, use a soft, knotless net or rubber mesh net. Knotless nets are now required in fly-fishing only areas and freshwater areas with selective gear rules.
· Use a hook remover (dehooker) when hooks are imbedded in the mouth or jaw.
· If a fish has swallowed the hook, cut the leader.
· Keep fingers away from the eyes and gills of the fish.

So first off, that's unbelievable - they actually followed you all day. Second, I intend on bringing my kids with me who are 8, 5, 3 and 6 months. The three oldest have cards and I plan on letting them try to haul one in, but if they can't then what, let it haul them in. If I let the kid reel while I hold the rod does that count? What if their unlicensed mother hold the rod, is she in jail? Well done WDFW well done indeed!

Current regs pamhlet, pg 7, YOUTH FISHING:

WDFW strongly supports and promotes youth fishing. Everyone 15 years of age and older must have a license. Children 14 years of age and under do not require a license, but they must actively participate and be able to demonstrate the ability to handle the gear by themselves. They must follow all the rules and restrictions for that particular species and/or body of water, and are allowed the same daily limit as an adult. Adults may assist and are not required to have a license if they will not be fishing/harvesting themselves, but children must be present and take part in the entire process.

Pay close attention to the highlighted text, this will be interpreted by a warden so be careful with how much assistance you or your wife provide.

In case you don't know, under HARVEST AND POSSESSION RULES, pg 12, 2012 - 2013 Rules Pamphlet, in the YOU MAY NOT sections:

Harvest any part of another person’s daily limit, except for persons who possess a Designated Harvester Card.

Continue to fish for salmon after the adult portion of the daily limit has been retained.

If each of your 3 kids catch and retain one salmon apiece at Baker you are through for the day. YOU may not also catch and retain a limit!

Well, later in the morning, we were marking a lot of fish and hooked up on a double header, well i already had 2 fish on my card and my buddy had none. Well we were each fighting a fish, and it just so happened that my buddies fish came off and mine stayed on, I was going to hand off the rod but we had a double, and by the time he lost his, mine was tired. To make a long story short, we netted the fish, and yes, i fought the fish for the majority of the fight, and we marked it on my buddies card so i wouldnt have 3 fish limit on my card.

Did your buddy ever take the rod or did you bring it to the boat? Who netted the fish?

I suppose if you fought the fish, brought it boat side, then handed the rod to your buddy so you could net the fish, I could understand, and agree, with why you were cited because IMO you caught the fish. Hooking the fish then handing the rod off, no way I would see a problem. I searched the rules and couldn't find any reference to fighting a fish for the "majority of the fight". Who determines what that is and at what point would you not be able to hand the rod off to someone else? If you fought the fish a short while, handed the rod off to your buddy, he continued to fight the fish, he brought it boat side, and you netted it, then I agree with you, the citation is not valid and you should prevail in court.

[rseas]

thanks for pointing the 3 fish limit out, Bodo. i had thought that he was "Fishin' for the boat" your point is well said.

...SHOW me in the rule book where it specifies who's card it goes on. Is it whos pole it bites on, who hooks it, who holds the rod when the fish in netted? It doesnt say!, the warden was puzzled also but decided to make up his own rule saying because i fought the majority of the fish that it was "mine".

thats not gonna hold up in court, if I show the judge my 2 fish on my card, and tell him that I was only holding and reeling because my buddy was busy with another fish, and my buddy initially had fought the fish and set the hook, and TO ME the rod that gets bit is the guy who marks it, then its simply not going to hold up.

[If it specified in the rule book what the guidelines for marking fish in regard to who set the hook/fought it then fine, ill pay the ticket, but since it doesnt, it will not hold up, because i only had 2 fish on my card. Or does it say somewhere? The warden HIMSELF said its not in the book, so he made up the "majority" thing to give me a ticket. Personally, i believe the person who hooked the fish on their rod is more responsible for the fish that the person who simply reels it to the net, but then again its OK to hand off and fight it, then mark your card, theres simply no rule that specifies...

This is a tough one and I am sorry to hear about your misfortune. At my end I would be really confused. On my boat there is no such thing as "my rod" I am running 2, 4, 6 or what ever number of rods is legal for the number of licensed passengers I have on-board. The first fish always goes to the guest fisherman or children on board then we rotate from there. If it a child's turn or one of our special needs guests is up then I will help fight the fish, maybe even holding the rod and netting the fish at the same time. In their heart the fish is theirs and it would go on their catch record. As noted earlier, the regulations do not specifically address or define who's fish it is.

[geljockey]

FF, I'm also sorry to hear about your encounter. My understanding of things is that it's not so much as who the rod belongs to, but who is controlling the fishing gear. As stated in the pamphlet "all fishing gear must be kept in immediate control and may not be left unattended."

So if your friend sets the hook he is the one controlling the gear. If he then hands the rod off to you, you're now controlling the gear.

Did you get the ticket after you started fishing for a bit after landing that particular fish? Were you in control of the fishing gear when the fish was landed? The only way I could rationalize the ticket is that you were in control of the gear when the fish was landed. Since you were fishing in freshwater, you can't fish for the boat, so you have to mark your punchcard. Then if you continued to fish, you would be fishing after having caught your limit.

If I remember your description of the event, the officer didn't even bring that up.

So if you do decide to fight this in court, I wish you well. Since it seems there was some confusion on the officer's part, you may be able to win this thing. There is also the possibility of the officer not showing up at court.

Let us know what happens if you do fight this.

[RiverChromeGS]

What happened was my buddy set the hook with MY ROD because he hadnt caught one. Then. 10 seconds later his rod gets hammered. So he hands the rod back to me to fight his own. He then loses his fish and the one i have is finished and 2 feet from the boat. So we net and mark on his card cause it was originally suppose to be his fish but i ended up being forced to reel him in. Kinda confusing and dumb i got a ticket for it. THE GAME WARDEN MADE UP THE MAJORITY THING... Wtf.

By the way went 3 for 7 for a solo limit today. Little slow but fish were caught throughout morning

[RiverChromeGS]

And yes im gonna contest it fo sho

[Bodofish]

I'll be up Tuesday, I sure hope the weather straightens up, it would be nice to have a little sun. Good luck on the ticket, I haven't lost on one yet when it came time to stand up. In fact I had a judge toss out every ticket they wrote one afternoon, just to teach them to follow the rules and do it right.

[rseas]

As defined by the regulations, what does "fishing for the boat" mean? What or why is there a difference between the marine and freshwater regulations in this matter?

[RiverChromeGS]

heres my fish today! went 3 for 7, rainy, windy but fish were being caught in the early morning, i wasnt doing great early, losing fish and not getting many bites, but at 9am when i was about to leave i marked a huge school as i was pulling my gear to leave, so i dropped back down to them BOOM double header for a limit. Netting 2 salmon simultaneously on my own was quite the spectacle and i had some applauders.

Rseas, i have no idea, thats why im optimistic about contesting the ticket, they have nothing to use against me

I should be up sunday monday or tuesday, not sure which..

[TomD]

Continue to fish for salmon after the adult portion of the daily limit has been retained.
If each of your 3 kids catch and retain one salmon apiece at Baker you are through for the day. YOU may not also catch and retain a limit!

Hewesfisher - this doesn't refer to the fisherperson... it refers to the salmon...

In areas where there is a different limit... like the Cowlitz where you can catch 6 salmon, only 2 of which may be adults...

If you take your second adult, you are done, regardless of how many jacks you do or don't have...

[Bodofish]

Continue to fish for salmon after the adult portion of the daily limit has been retained.
If each of your 3 kids catch and retain one salmon apiece at Baker you are through for the day. YOU may not also catch and retain a limit!

Hewesfisher - this doesn't refer to the fisherperson... it refers to the salmon...

In areas where there is a different limit... like the Cowlitz where you can catch 6 salmon, only 2 of which may be adults...

If you take your second adult, you are done, regardless of how many jacks you do or don't have...

I think Hewes has it backwards on this one and I'd go to the mat on it as I had this explained to me when I bitched about all the Latino families fishing as a family at the Quincy Lakes. The warden told me as long as the adults have not taken their limit they can continue to fish. So the adults can help fish with the kids till the kids fill their card and then fish for theirs. But, if the adults fill their cards, everyone is done. It would be silly to think that the adults can only fish till the kids fill their card, it’s just not what it says.

[FishBaitThe2nd]

wow, that really sucks FF ! I hope all goes well in court, i dont see why it wouldnt. Some wardens these days...
Nice fish though ! Someone should take me to baker.

[dutchman2858]

Bugmasta: Don't know if "steeleywhopper" has law enforcement associations or not, but I do: 20+ years as Alaska Fish and Wildlife Trooper. I DO know that you've only got one side of the story: "fishenfreak's." What he says may be absolutely true...but I can tell you that in those 20 yrs of law enforcement I can count on one hand the number of guys who got tickets, stood tall, and said "Yep, I was wrong," without some excuse or comment about how we should be spending our time on somebody else.

The laws may not be easily understood, or entirely fairly enforced, but in spite of all the talk of us all being law abiding fishermen, there's only one group of guys who cared enough to take the job, get the training, and put the time in on the front lines to protect the resource...the wardens.

Yeah, I know, Bugmasta, "I'm not gonna make lots of friends."