Christine is at it again

[Uncle Wes]

Yes our Governor is at it again, in her latest proposal she wants to shut down 7 hatcheries and cut back enforcement officers to help cover her 5.7 Billion Dollar deficet. And if thats not enough she also wants to raise the cost of licenses to boot nothing like paying more for less. To put this in perspective one of these hatcheries alone supplies 39 lakes. As I recall she said there was no deficet when she was running for office. These closures will effect everyone around the state she is whacking away at a 1.5 billion dollar industry that employs many and is also a recreational activity that most can afford. Don't let her get away with this, place your call to the Governors office and voice your objections for a careless move with no thought of the reprecussions of such action. If you would like to read more go to chronline.com.

[Marc Martyn]

Documentation please.

[Mud Duck]

Documentation please.

Link

[Toni]

WDFW Proposed budget: http://www.ofm.wa.gov/budget09/recsum/477.pdf
Other agencies: http://www.ofm.wa.gov/budget09/highlights/default.asp

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Yes our Governor is at it again, in her latest proposal she wants to shut down 7 hatcheries and cut back enforcement officers to help cover her 5.7 Billion Dollar deficet. And if thats not enough she also wants to raise the cost of licenses to boot nothing like paying more for less. To put this in perspective one of these hatcheries alone supplies 39 lakes. As I recall she said there was no deficet when she was running for office. These closures will effect everyone around the state she is whacking away at a 1.5 billion dollar industry that employs many and is also a recreational activity that most can afford. Don't let her get away with this, place your call to the Governors office and voice your objections for a careless move with no thought of the reprecussions of such action. If you would like to read more go to chronline.com.

Yes, its amazing to me how Christine can make proposals to cut most of our state’s departmental budgets including WDFW's and yet, at the same time, increase our state elected officials wages by 4.4%. Come on Christine, let’s be fair across the board.

[Mike Carey]

Isn't raising license fees a tax increase?

[Marc Martyn]

I guess that you can blame it on Christine. That's easy. The truth of the matter is that the economy is in the toilet, period. The revenues are down for the state and their costs have increased dramatically, especially transportation costs for the state. The weather this year is setting new records. Fuel prices went to an all time high. Home sales are down to record lows. New home construction is also way down. Companies are going out of business are increasing rates. Retail sales are way down. People are not buying new vehicles. Health costs are sky rocketing. Unemployment claims are increasing.
Fishing is a recreation for many. Although they may cut back on hatchery operations and productions, I doubt that it will be permanent. They will eventually reopen them but it may be a few years.
This country is in a real mess and we are all going to have to make adjustments to deal with it.

Mike- The way I see it, a fishing license is a fee, not a tax. It is not an added amount to a service or product at a set percentage.

[Mike Carey]

I guess that you can blame it on Christine. That's easy. The truth of the matter is that the economy is in the toilet, period. The revenues are down for the state and their costs have increased dramatically, especially transportation costs for the state. The weather this year is setting new records. Fuel prices went to an all time high. Home sales are down to record lows. New home construction is also way down. Companies are going out of business are increasing rates. Retail sales are way down. People are not buying new vehicles. Health costs are sky rocketing. Unemployment claims are increasing.
Fishing is a recreation for many. Although they may cut back on hatchery operations and productions, I doubt that it will be permanent. They will eventually reopen them but it may be a few years.
This country is in a real mess and we are all going to have to make adjustments to deal with it.

Mike- The way I see it, a fishing license is a fee, not a tax. It is not an added amount to a service or product at a set percentage.

When is a tax not a tax - when it's a fee. :compress:

Maybe the massive spending increases of the past few years have something to do with the deficit, do you think?

[swedefish4life1]

[Anonymous]

I guess that you can blame it on Christine. That's easy. The truth of the matter is that the economy is in the toilet, period. The revenues are down for the state and their costs have increased dramatically, especially transportation costs for the state. The weather this year is setting new records. Fuel prices went to an all time high. Home sales are down to record lows. New home construction is also way down. Companies are going out of business are increasing rates. Retail sales are way down. People are not buying new vehicles. Health costs are sky rocketing. Unemployment claims are increasing.
Fishing is a recreation for many. Although they may cut back on hatchery operations and productions, I doubt that it will be permanent. They will eventually reopen them but it may be a few years.
This country is in a real mess and we are all going to have to make adjustments to deal with it.

Mike- The way I see it, a fishing license is a fee, not a tax. It is not an added amount to a service or product at a set percentage.

You are right about the economy. In fact you are right about very thing in this post. So why is Christine proposing a 4.4% wage increase for herself and all other elected officials? Go ask your employer for a 4.4% increase in your wages and see what he says or does. Maybe it's a boot out the door!

[swedefish4life1]

[SmokinAces]

Where'd Swede's comments go?

[Anonymous]

Not to pick on Marc, but here's a list of tax definitions:

A Tax is a financial charge or other levy imposed on an individual or a legal entity by a state or a functional equivalent of a state (for example ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax

Money paid to the government for financing public expenses; To impose and collect a tax
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Tax

A percentage of the final sales price that is required to be paid to local, state, and/or federal governments.
http://www.wachoviadealer.com/Consumers ... efault.asp

Enforced charge exacted of persons, corporations and organizations by the government to be used to support government services and programs.
www.bohmcre.com/GlossaryofTerms/t.htm


I'd venture to say that ANY monies take by a state entity to pay for state operations is a "tax". IMHO. (BTW, I love the use of the word "extracted" in the last defnition. I feel extracted a lot these days!)

[Marc Martyn]

Oh, come on Mike, I know you are picking on me :thumright

Counterpoint-
A fee is the price one pays as remuneration for services, especially the honorarium paid to a doctor, lawyer, consultant, or other member of a learned profession. Fees usually allow for overhead, wages, costs, and markup-wikipedia

Even if they raise the cost of a license, how much could that be, a couple of dollars? Skip the Latte on the way to work Monday morning and it will probably cover the increase of the fee. Of course, when you buy your next one, you are going to have to pay "tax" on the beverage.

[Mike Carey]

well, ok, then we are starting with our definitions wrong to begin with. You originally said a fishing license is a fee, but that doesn't match up with your latest post. Our licenses are not "fees" by the definition you have just posted because they are not payment for a service. Or, you could say that ALL taxes are fees because they all pay in one way or another for government "services".

So we get back to my original issue, which was - Chrissy promised no new tax increases. But if the license costs more, how can that not be a tax increase? Really, this is all just symantics - tax, fee, licenses, whatever you call it - it's money extracted from me to pay for government functions.

As to I can afford it becaue it's just another latter - well, from where I'm sitting it's a whole LOT of lattes, one drip at a time. Or to put it another way, would you like your arm twisted severely right now or shall we do it slowwww and steady?

My main point beyond all the above is that, once again, a politician says one thing to get elected and promptly changes his/her own tune. It's the nature of the political beast in my opinion.

I would have minded a little less if she had been honest and said you know, tough times, we spent too much money and created too many programs and now we are going to have to ask the citizens of Washington to pay for these added expenses. It's called taking responcibiity for one's actions. It's what I try to teach my kids anyway.

[Marc Martyn]

Our licenses are not "fees" by the definition you have just posted because they are not payment for a service.

The raising of fish and stocking of lakes I would consider a service. Enforcement of game laws is also a service. Money collected for a service that you choose not to use is a tax, like public transit.

"Dino" would be doing the same thing. However, he would start cutting funding for Eastern Washington first before he would even look at the west side. He was over in Spokane once while he was campaigning and stayed for about an hour.

[Lotech Joe]

The problem with politics is that you don't have to try to find someone to disagree with you. It has a nasty way of putting a wedge between friends. Sometimes I wish all this political bantering would just go away. All too often, expressing a political viewpoint is tantamount to badmouthing someone's differing ideology. I'm not putting my head in the sand here. I have my beliefs and I do and will act on them. I just don't choose to share. My friendships at WL.com are too important to me, to risk them with a political statement.
Well there, now I've gone and made a political statement. RATS!

[Anonymous]

I think it's OK, at least with me and I hope Marc feels the same. We're just bantering (at least I hope Marc knows I'm just having a freindly debate with him). I know friendships are more important than politics. And besides, two friends should never get in a fight over a woman.

I still think it's a tax increase, LOL.

We'll have to agree to disagree I guess.

[Marc Martyn]

Some people take you and I too seriously, Mike. This debate reminds me of the McDonald's commercial they have been running recently. Two guys are sitting in a booth and one says "This sausage egg McMuffin sure cures my hunger pains." The other guys says "It's pangs, not pains." They go back and forth about the correct word usage. Finally the first guy gets up to leave and says "it's pains" as he is leaving. The second guy replies "your a pain".

[Anonymous]

yup. someones always gotta have the last word... it's a ta.. it's a ta... it's a - oh never mind.