Ask an ex-WDFW employee anything!

[Amx]

[YellowBear]

We can see by the results of some of our WDFW projects that warm water species do need some help sometimes. Case in point, Sprague lakes latest warm water program. Another that come's to mind is Coffee pot, this lake was once promoted by WDFW as a Trophy Bass lake. Lets not forget the Liberty lake Walleye project. If Trout do not reproduce well in our waters, then why do we spend so much to get so little? We have some of the highest priced license fees in the country that pay for pet projects that cannot support themselves.

[Juniah87]

That is a good question, and one I wish I knew the answer to. Alot of the hatcheries don't even produce their own eggs or have a broodstock program. At least the 4 hatcheries I've worked at that also raise trout didn't. I think it is a side effect of so much inbreeding. I started a broodstock program at the Bellingham hatchery as a student lead, however they were killed in an unusually hot summer, along with about 90% of the entire hatchery population, after I graduated. That is actually what the pic in my avatar is from. We had very large trout at Puyallup as well, but a lot of them were triploids, and sterile. I don't know much about warm-water species in the hatchery setting, but I am assuming they focus so much on trout because they are so easy to raise in the waters we have available. They do well in the temperatures that are readily available in our streams and larger lakes for the most part, so there doesnt' need to be a bunch of heating or cooling aparatuses involved to keep the fish alive. I do wish they would invest more time and money into the warm-water species in hatcheries. And again, my experiece is limited to a handful of hatcheries in the west part of the state, they may do things differently elsewhere.

I sure wish I knew where all the money from license sales and taxes allocated for WDFW went, they sure don't go to the workers. Like I stated in a different topic, WDFW hatchery workers don't get paid very well in comparison to hatchery workers of other states. Minnesota's average wage for a hatchery specialist 3 is in the ballpark of 60,000 a year. Hatchery specialist 4's in Washington make around 35,000 if I remember correctly. It's also strange how different every hatchery is. Puyallup Hatchery was on the verge of being shut down several times, and the equipment we used was being bought from places like pawn shops and craigslist. At the same time, the hatchery in Orting was having a new multi-million dollar facility built. It is very confusing, and probably very political.

[fishkin4]

Do you know why the state doesn't consider starting a Dolly Varden hatchery program? Has there been any talk of it? Seems Dollys being native would be more practical than the German Brown. I would think they would thrive much better than rainbow plants and at the same time would control the spinyray. Just think of the opportunity and benifits a Dolly Varden hatchery stocking program would bring to this state.

[ridgeratt]

Do you have any knowledge about the copods being found in the kokanee gills. Is this something that is being transplanted with the stocking of the kokanee fry from the hatchery?

WDFW identified the parasite as a species of copepod, salmincola californiensis. Copepods are a small crustacean found in nearly every fresh and salt water habitat. Those fish lice you see on ocean run salmon are copepods. I found this definition for salmincola: “parasitic crustaceans which attach to the gills of salmonid fish and cause obstruction of respiration and blood loss resulting in delayed sexual maturity, reduced growth rate and some mortality.”*

[Juniah87]

Do you know why the state doesn't consider starting a Dolly Varden hatchery program? Has there been any talk of it? Seems Dollys being native would be more practical than the German Brown. I would think they would thrive much better than rainbow plants and at the same time would control the spinyray. Just think of the opportunity and benifits a Dolly Varden hatchery stocking program would bring to this state.

No, I don't have any knowledge in this subject. My education and much of my work was dealing with salmon and trout. While there are many questions as to why WDFW doesn't do things a certain way, the discussions I had with fellow co-workers while working there was limited to speculation and guessing more then anything else (Mixed in with a lot of complaining, haha!) I wish I understood the ecology and habitat effects a little better, but when I was going through the program, the biology side was very limited. They have since hired a biology professor and the students get instruction from him for half the year, and from the professor that teaches state hatchery procedures, guidelines, and paperwork during the other half, but unfortunately I was not able to take advantage of this. Most of the biology information I learned while going through school and some even after graduating came from a lot of long discussions and lots of questions posed to the region 4 state veterinarian, who now no longer works for the state. Compensation for someone as knowledgeable as a certified vet was laughable, you really had to love the WDFW or the fishery in Washington to work there, because you sure aren't going to pay off your student loans working for what they were paying this man. (Again makes you wonder where all this money from license sales is REALLY going.) Sorry I couldn't provide more insight

Do you have any knowledge about the copods being found in the kokanee gills. Is this something that is being transplanted with the stocking of the kokanee fry from the hatchery?

WDFW identified the parasite as a species of copepod, salmincola californiensis. Copepods are a small crustacean found in nearly every fresh and salt water habitat. Those fish lice you see on ocean run salmon are copepods. I found this definition for salmincola: “parasitic crustaceans which attach to the gills of salmonid fish and cause obstruction of respiration and blood loss resulting in delayed sexual maturity, reduced growth rate and some mortality.”*

I'm assuming they are catching this outside of the hatchery setting, just because if there is a known copepod problem that is causing discomfort or stress, they will usually treat the ponds with potassium permanganate to rid the fish of them before planting to avoid several issues: death during or immidiately after transplant due to stress, and the introduction of a species into a water system that they do not know was there before. That being said, by the description you gave from WDFW it sounds like it would be rather difficult for a fish culturist to notice this was going on. "Some mortality" is generally accepted as normal, and unless it gets substantial, the risk of a pond dieing off because of stress induced by chemical treatments would probably keep them from treating. Also, most chemical treatments are quite expensive. But to answer your main question, no, I have not heard of that particular problem with the kokanee population. Are you aware of when this started showing up? I spent a significant amount of time working with South Lake Whatcom Hatchery with their kokanee, and hadn't heard of any particular disease or parasite problems.

[ridgeratt]

I wonder since the Kokanee eggs come from one lake is my understanding and now the Copods are starting to show up other Kokanee lakes.

I am aware of a few lakes that have a self sustaining Kokanee Population. That have been planted with fry over the last couple of years. Would hate to see the copods show up. My Father when he was alive always cleared the feeder streams so the fish could spawn naturally. In the fall they creeks would turn red. I have done my best to continue what he had done so I clear them as well.

Perhaps it's selfish on my part. Just hate to hate the resource get demolished.

I also am waiting to see the opening of the private fishery at Chapman lake open up as well. Talked to Region 1 Bio last year and he had hinted that it may open this year.

[Juniah87]

I wonder how long copepods can survive on a deceased host, that could come into play as well. If a bird picks up a carcass, and drops it into another body of water nearby, or another tributary, could that spread them? Pretty interesting concept.

I applaud your efforts to sustain a fantastic resource! Do be careful though, ecosystems are extremely complex, and what may be detrimental to one species may be the lifeblood of another.

Are there details posted anywhere about this private fishery on Chapman? I'd be interested in learning about that as well. It seems like there is always a kind of tension between private fish producing companies and the state. The state is always wary of the private industry because they think they will do everything they can in order to increase their bottom line instead of doing what is right for the environment and ecosystem, where the private companies look at the stat's spending habits and procedures and blow a gasket over how different things would be if they could implement their particular procedures instead. I've seen this from both sides, working for WDFW, then being head-hunted for a position with a fish-for-consumption company. It's a very interesting balancing act for sure, so it's fun to watch when these types of things start!

[fishkin4]

With all the money we give WDFW don't you think they could afford to raise a better genetic strain of trout and feed them a better quality feed to produce a bigger.better, quality table fair trout? Fishers these days I'm sure are into quality over quantity wouldn't you agree?

[Juniah87]

Quality over quantity is a very tough call. I think there would be opposition regardless of which they chose. We have an open discussion in the saltwater subsection with a lot of folks pretty upset about the salmon return forecast. Granted there was no quality increase with the quantity decrease. Also, the feed isn't chosen by one specific individual, and every hatchery is different, it is usually up to the hatchery manager to make the decision on feed orders. It's a balancing act between the number of fish they are allocated for the year, and quarterly budgets. If you want to catch the best table fare, I would suggest researching your local hatcheries. You can tell the ones that are funded better by just looking at the condition of their equipment and ponds. For example if I were wanting fish that were fed higher quality feed, I would look for lakes planted by trout lodge over say, garrison Springs.

As far as genetics go, it is the lack of diversity, not the specific stock, that lowers the strength and quality of the fish. Even if they switched genetic strains, they would still be inbreeding, and you would see the same problems. The current stock was based on a combination of growth rate, mortality rate, and disease resistance. We tried switching a few net pens to a different stock at the company I worked at. They were eggs shipped from Denmark. They were beautiful, strong fish, but they were very skidding, did not eat well, and had a higher mortality rate. It took us an additional 6 months to get them to harvest size, which is a big deal when you are talking about timing up limited space for fish rearing.

Hope that answers some of your questions!

[branweeds]

Okay Junior,

In your opinion, best stocker bow tackle for opening day? I feel like they are less inclined to go after flies and would almost prefer flashy spinners and bright smelly power bait. What do you think? Do they go after what looks similar to the feed from hatcheries?

[Juniah87]

So far, the best lure and my personal favorite trolling lure is a weightless black bead=headed woolly bugger tied directly to my mainline using monofilament of course. This was a tip I got from a very kind fisherman I spoke with. He saw me trolling on Toad Lake in Whatcom county in my pontoon. He was in a pontoon as well and rowed over to see how I was doing. He mentioned this lure, and I told him I'd have to stop at Yeagers and grab some. He told me that was nonsense, he tied his own flies, and pulled 3 woolly buggers off of the fly patch on his pontoon and gave them to me. I still have all 3 in my tackle box and have caught hundreds of trout on them!

A lot of anglers troll deep, but remember where a trouts eyes are, and what they can see. They can see in front and above, and are always looking up for possible predators. I'd suggest trolling whatever you have had success with in the past, but shallower. Trout are not picky when it comes to feed, they will eat anything that hits the surface. We have to put up signs at the more touristy hatcheries to keep people from throwing rocks into the tanks because they will eat them and kill them. The secret isn't so much in the lure, but the location. Hope that helps, and I hope you fill your boat with tripods next Saturday!

[branweeds]

Okay I will see about giving that a shot. I have had luck with cone head wooly bugger on a floating fly line and longer leader, not allowing them to sink too deep. I have also heard that the hatchery fish stay shallow in the lakes after being planted, so either way it sounds like a good idea to keep it shallow.

[Juniah87]

Okay I will see about giving that a shot. I have had luck with cone head wooly bugger on a floating fly line and longer leader, not allowing them to sink too deep. I have also heard that the hatchery fish stay shallow in the lakes after being planted, so either way it sounds like a good idea to keep it shallow.

Sounds like a good idea, let me know how it turns out! (Don't forget to fill out a fishing report afterwards!!)

Just saw this report. Check out what he was using ;)

http://www.northwestfishingreports.com/ ... lid=63&t=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[riverhunter]

Woolly buggers trolled behind a flasher also work great. No weight needed just use the flasher to get just below the surface. I also have caught hundreds of trout while others are using traditional hardware and having a little tougher days.

[YellowBear]

Juniah87, What do you know about the long term plans of the Columbia River fisheries, including lake Roosevelt?

[Juniah87]

Sorry YellowBear, my time was spent much further north than the Columbia or Lake Roosevelt, those topics are out of my wheelhouse.