Tribal gill net at the Shipwreck

[BARCHASER10]

Dropped gear at 6:30 this AM near the Shipwreck. My friend Pat and I did well with 4 decent Silvers by 9AM including one that was 9 pounds. The others were 5-6 so they are a little bigger than last week.

I saw something this morning that got me worked up. This morning there was a tribal gill netter about 200 yards north of the Shipwreck. He was anchored well offshore at 450 feet with a string of big orange buoys going to the beach. Right in the middle of the most heavily used sport fishing spot in Puget Sound this time of year. Sucks!!

I'm used to seeing purse seiners north of Mulk but not gill netters this far south. Also this guy is obviously getting a lot of Silvers as well as Pinks. I'm used to seeing the tribes take Pinks, I expect that. But not taking Silvers and not in a sport fishing area. We may be on the verge of losing the Silver run to the Indians. Remember they have pretty much cleaned out the Chum runs on the S rivers. You cant even fish for Chums anymore on the S rivers, the tribes fished it out. Are Silvers next?

I hope this is over soon. The fact that that don't have rights anymore makes me think Trump may be the guy.

[Onmygame]

Tribal netting in Puget Sound is nothing new, and nothing to get worked up about when you consider the mandated fish allocation, as well as the fish production put forth by the 50+ tribal hatcheries in WA State.

There is no them vs us - as everyone has been working together (state, federal, tribal) side by side to restore runs as best as they can...working with what they have.

[BARCHASER10]

Sorry, I don't buy that nicety nice stuff. Sport fishers are just getting screwed. How do you explain the Chum run in the Snohomish system went from 400,000 fish to 30,000? Same with the Stilly and the Skagit? It was tribal over harvest. the tribes don't care about the runs they only care about money! I've been fishing the Wreck every Sept for over 30 years and this is the first time I''ve ever seen a gill netter at the Wreck when Silvers are running!

You sound like a tribal plant!

[strider43]

Sorry, I don't buy that nicety nice stuff. Sport fishers are just getting screwed. How do you explain the Chum run in the Snohomish system went from 400,000 fish to 30,000? Same with the Stilly and the Skagit? It was tribal over harvest. the tribes don't care about the runs they only care about money! I've been fishing the Wreck every Sept for over 30 years and this is the first time I''ve ever seen a gill netter at the Wreck when Silvers are running!

You sound like a tribal plant!

The reality is that Indians no longer need fishing for sustenance, it purely for money which they don't need to destroy another fishery just for more money

[Matt]

I would much much rather see gill nets in the bay than in the rivers. Probably a Tulalip boat, and their hatchery does Chum, Chinook, and Coho... so they kind of have every right to those fish, especially considering they DO NOT net the Snohomish River.

No harm no foul I say. Let em' fish.

[cobrar543]

I would much much rather see gill nets in the bay than in the rivers. Probably a Tulalip boat, and their hatchery does Chum, Chinook, and Coho... so they kind of have every right to those fish, especially considering they DO NOT net the Snohomish River.

No harm no foul I say. Let em' fish.

I agree. To each his own. Trump? really? sigh

[KarpKilla]

Barchaser, what does Trump have to do with any of this, get outta here with that man!

[DavidA]

It's good to see common sense weigh in on this. If you spot something you believe to be illegal, call state or tribal enforcement. Except for a few outlaws, tribal and non-tribal should all be on the same side. If the fish are gone everybody loses.

And I have to agree .. Trump!?!?

[jonb]

trump is a filthy rich billionaire out to fill his own pocket. this presidency would give him the power he needs to do that. no more no less. he is a selfish, racist xenophoebic bully with his own interests put well above all others. voting for trump would be the stupedist thing a person could do to their nation. vote for trump= go to war with iran.. is that what you want???
the man just has no business in office. im a registered independent, im not a democrat or republican, i like ideas from kasich and ron paul, i like ideas from bernie sanders and other liberals... ive yet to see a single shred of anything i like or even remotely respected from donald trump...

[ptfletcher]

I would like see gill-netting banned, period. Anywhere, anytime, by anybody.

[jonb]

pfletcher, i like the way you think. ban gill netting by all, not because they are native or comnercial or whatever, but because its bycatch is aweful and its kill is excessive. i totally agree.

[BARCHASER10]

Sorry I got a bit out of hand. But, when I first moved to Seattle in 1980, I could fish all year around for salmon and the rivers were quite good for Steelies and Chum. I'm 71, originally from Portland but also spent time in Billings and Spokane.

These days good local fishing kinda boils down to 2-3 months, odd year Pinks and Fall Silvers. Otherwise get in your truck and drive for 4-5-6 hours somewhere... and I do a lot of that, Sekiu, Columbia, Willamette, Ucluelet, Tilllamook Bay and other places.

Winter/Spring Blackmouth.. pretty close to dead in 8,9 and 10. I used to do well in Saratoga Passage, Elger Bay, Racetrack etc as recently as 10 years ago. We would fish it Dec into April. Not much there now.

Catching Chums in the Sky was a blast. That fishery is dead. Ten years ago the Sno system had a Chum run of 300,000, 30,000 now and I blame the Tribes for that. Chums got real profitable cause of the demand for Chum roe and the tribes simply over fished it. You are not allowed to sport fish for Chums now in any of the S rivers. I suspect the same thing is happening to the Hood Canal Chum runs. Is there an ESA listing in the future?

I don't know what is going on with summer Chinooks. Early last Spring there was talk of higher quotas and then suddenly they closed MA 10 and put a skinny little quota in MA 9. I suspect the tribes are behind it. This fishery may be breathing hard too.

And there is winter Steelies. Not good in local rivers and it will get worse cause there are no longer hatchery Steelhead in the Sky. The Nate Mafia did this. At best this fishery is also breathing hard. Used to be red hot in the 80's when I first moved here. I grew up fishing the Wilson, Trask, Nehalem and Nestucca in Oregon which still have good runs but we do not.

There hasn't been a Sockeye run in Lake Washington for 10 years. Dead duck!

So I'm sick of it. What used to be a year around salmon/steelhead fishery is 2-3 months of good fishing for odd year Pinks and Fall Silvers. That's it. If the Pinks and most of all Fall Silvers die off... local salmon/steelhead fishing is gone.

So, Yes, I get absolutely incensed when I see some guy with a 1/2 mile gillnet parked in front of the Wreck. Tribes have a lot of rights but they also abuse them.

(The Trump thing was an attention getter and it worked. I spent 36 years in banking and I know a little about Trumps reputation and it aint good. I dont like him either. But I can sure understand why some folks like him. A lot of people get upset with all the special interest groups and their heritage we always hear about... when you and I apparently have no heritage.)

I grew up fishing for Salmon and Steelhead around Portland. I caught my first Spring Chinook in 1952 at the age of 8. What happened to my heritage? My fishing buddy is in his mid 60's, grew up in Burlington and he tells me stories of what the Skagit used to be like.

I starting to rant. I quit.

[fishkin4]

You nailed it Barchaser.. All we have left is the pinks and coho locally and they get hit harder by nets each year. Human greed is a terrible thing.

[Larry3215]

I dont know enough about how the fishing "management "process works to know who to blame, but its sure as hell NOT working - unless you can call having fewer and fewer fish to catch each year "management". Ive been fishing Puget sound and the ocean for the last 20 years or so and it gets worse every year. Its not just salmon either. Its rock fish, lings, etc etc etc.

The people "managing" our fisheries are managing them out of existence.

[wlai]

<sarcasm>
Anyone wanting to rant against how horribly unfair everything is, how tribes act like they used to own the continent or something, and the gall they have to harvest from the rivers named after their ancestors, check out the many Facebook groups for Washington fishing. You may enjoy their company.
</sarcasm>

On the other hand, I can totally get behind banning gill nets due to the bycatch.

[Onmygame]

As a passionate sport fisherman who was born and raised in WA State, and has been fishing here since the early 1960s, I am mindful of the following -

Tribal fishermen have an allotment of up to 50% of HARVESTABLE fish guaranteed to them in the Boldt Decision of 1974 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_St ... Washington" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Non Indian commercial fishermen take up most of the rest locally - and we sport fishermen pretty much are left the scraps, even though we foot a good chunk of the bill.

When you consider all things enemy to our migratory fish, tribal gill netters are not one of them. These however are....

- International fishing fleets - both legal and illegal - stretching nets for miles in the open ocean, factory trawlers that make every living thing a by / catch

- Pollution - it isn't just the sewage and agricultural runoff in our streams and bays, it is the garbage in the ocean that is killing off most of the marine life that remains. There is a solid vortex island of trash between Hawaii and the west coast that when last measured was TWICE the size of the State of Texas. Another equal in size or larger east of Hawaii, with smaller trash vortexes scattered. Mostly plastic - this crud breaks down into smaller pieces ingested by the fish. The oceans are dying - plain and simple. Closer to home, Hood Canal has recently had massive fish die offs due to near zero oxygen in the water, and multiple salmon runs throughout the Sound have suffered mortality IN THE STREAMS before spawning. No solid answers yet as to why.

- Climate change - El Nino is back with a vengeance, and it messes up fishing each and every time.

- Hydroelectric Dams - They're still there...

- Fisheries Mismanagement - While the biologists teams are trying their best with tied hands and limited budgets at hatchery level, the bureaucratic nonsense continues to eat up the pie. Enough said.

OP - if a run of MIGRATORY FISH was reduced from 400K to 30K - it likely means they never made it back.

The idea that the tribes are taking out of the coffer and not putting back in have no merit. They have built over 50 hatcheries since the '80s (most of which are on streams that had no hatcheries previously). As an example, this last year, the Skokomish Tribe committed over $50M dollars to a new Sockeye Hatchery Facility geared toward restoring a run decimated by hydroelectric dams. Tacoma Public Utilities will also be putting in money on that project.

Blaming an entire group for taking more than their share in a HIGHLY regulated fishery (with nothing more than emotion as a basis) is so 1970s. I had hoped we'd all moved on.

And as an aside - you say that you mentioned Trump on here just to get a reaction?? I suppose if trolling is slow at the Wreck, you can always try here.

The best of luck.

OnMyGame

[BARCHASER10]

Actually, trolling at the Wreck has been really good. We limited 4 times since we started fishing for Silvers a week ago.

Trump is a real character, by no means qualified to even be a dog catcher. There was a commercial RE boom in the 80's which turned into a gigantic coml RE bust around 1990. Trump was one of the most over extended developers. He was never liquid. Every penny went to acquire more properties including a lot of old buildings that produced little cash flow known as "property held for future development".

He owed money to most of the large banks on the east coast and his financials were a huge mess. The banks kept him out of bankruptcy because they didnt want to turn this mess over to a bankruptcy judge and lose all control. They wanted to settle it all among themselves, share the losses and needed Trumps cooperation which is what happened.

After that Trump couldn't borrow a nickel to build a hot dog stand. He reinvented himself into a "Brand", a promoter and property manager. It was hugely successful. I laugh when he talks about "his" Trump Properties. Other than small minority interests, he doesn't own most of those. He just promotes, sells and manages them. He still owns some projects but the rumor is he is pretty liquid.

Lindsey Graham called him a bullshit artist, you bet, maybe the best ever.

[jonb]

very good description of trump barchaser, yes he is a bulls***er. the ultimate snake oil salesman.

[ptfletcher]

OnMyGame,
What you said.

[KarpKilla]

OnMyGame is on his game!