Watch what you say online - expose on treaty negotiations

[natetreat]

http://www.irehr.org/2016/05/13/bigotry ... y-fishing/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is a lesson that sport fisherman should take to heart: People are watching how you conduct yourself online. When you post, you're representing the sport fishermen as a group, and in public forums, your behavior is going to dictate how the non-fishing public sees us.

[The Quadfather]

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[primetime]

What a completely biased article. This was obviously written by someone looking to write a story and get some attention. There are always people who say things that should not be said on the internet. This article seemed to basically try to portray every sports angler as a racist POS. I hate when writers do this. They take an issue and try to twist it to get their point across.
I just want to take my drift boat out for summer run!

[Bodofish]

If you feel you are being unjustly portrayed, just look up the domain name at whois . net. You can glean the owner of the site and the means to contact them. Let them know how you feel.

[BARCHASER10]

Who are those people? Sounds like some sort of Tea Party outfit. The article sounds like a plant.

Edit: I read some of the other articles. It isn't Tea Party, its some sort of outfit that promotes "Native American" causes. Given their cause the article is about what you would expect.

[Larry3215]

Its definitely biased towards the tribes viewpoints, but thats how you would expect them to be isnt it?

They are presenting themselves in the best light and from their point of view - the same most of us would do.

The problem is, there is a lot of truth in that article to go along with the biased statements. Compared to some of the things I've heard and read from "our side" (some were quoted in that article), I think they were downright reasonable and incredibly polite and reserved.

If I was in their shoes, having some of that crap thrown at me, I dont know if I would be taking it nearly so well. Actually, I know I wouldnt. Id be fighting mad.

I am disgusted that the political asses running for president have made it OK to be to be openly racist and to advocate violence to resolve a dispute - over fishing of all things!

Come on guys. We should be better than this. We need to tone things down. Angry, hate filled words, and especially violence, isnt going to get us back on the water. It will only make things worse.

[Bodofish]

I think he's pretty much just a guy looking to champion anyone that needs a little championing. At this point. He's championing for the trives whether they need it or not.

[natetreat]

Its definitely biased towards the tribes viewpoints, but thats how you would expect them to be isnt it?

They are presenting themselves in the best light and from their point of view - the same most of us would do.

The problem is, there is a lot of truth in that article to go along with the biased statements. Compared to some of the things I've heard and read from "our side" (some were quoted in that article), I think they were downright reasonable and incredibly polite and reserved.

If I was in their shoes, having some of that crap thrown at me, I dont know if I would be taking it nearly so well. Actually, I know I wouldnt. Id be fighting mad.

I am disgusted that the political asses running for president have made it OK to be to be openly racist and to advocate violence to resolve a dispute - over fishing of all things!

Come on guys. We should be better than this. We need to tone things down. Angry, hate filled words, and especially violence, isnt going to get us back on the water. It will only make things worse.

Well said.

[Goldrigger1]

People are frustrated by the lack of fish returning. It is frustrating. When odd things like this warm ocean water event and lack of rain happens we just have to roll with fate and be patient. We rec. fisherman can afford to be patient. People with their livelyhoods at stake have a hardship and should receive favoritism. It is the fair way.

Have patience. Events work out in the end if we are honorable people.

As for this writer.... I don't like people who have been indoctrinated by a biased school system and have never questioned the biased information they were delivered during their education. There are so many of this type.

And I must say our founding fathers got most of their inspiration from French philosophers who founded and named the "Liberal Party". There was also some love for the Danes in the 1600s who founded an early "republic" which is what our founders created. I say this cause so much of our country's creative inspiration has been forgotten. I feel I must say it so we remember why we have such a great and unique place to live in freedom. So let's be informed, happy and count our blessings instead of going ape over weird events we have no control of.

[jonb]

Larry, goldrigger, well thought out repsonses, if there was a like button i would hit it.

The acticle is very biased, so much so its hard to read through it. I really hate how the media opperates now a days. its as if they think we are too dumb to formulate our own opinions based on data and facts. I dont want to be force fed their rhetoric. this arcticle does little for their cause, simply for the fact they refused to show the other side of the argument.

On the other hand i have seen the ridiculous behavior of sportsfishers and have warned a few people about the negative results a protest fishery would have on this cause among other issues. I hate to say i told you so.... But i told you so. Be the change you hope to see in the world, thats the only way to resolve this without giving the sportfishing community a black eye and an embarrassing point in history. Donald trump supporters, please stay home and stay off the internet, you are embarrassing us.

[Goldrigger1]

Thanks Jon. Nice to get a callout from you. I really enjoyed all your posts last year on how to get silvers in the Snoho. River. I learned a lot and have incorporated many of your ideas into how I will approach low-water fishing.

I think of Trump and have to chuckle immediately. I see him kind of like WC Fields the late actor from the 1930s. I was driving back from fishing the Columbia near I-5 and thought about Trump and Sanders gaining so many voters. My "guess" and it is a wild guess, is a lot of voters are really mad at today's status quo politicians. I know I am. I don't want Marxism and I don't want a revolt like Germany which ended in Hitler. I just see lots of anger. Too many of the elected politicians aren't even honest people.

[BARCHASER10]

I certainly agree with stopping the rough and racial talk. But I also think we are at a crossroads. I didn't believe it at first but I really think the tribes want us off the water particularly the salt and the south sound rivers. I'm 72 and I've had 60 years of great salmon/steelhead fishing. You younger guys have more to lose than me.

This all reminds me of my previous experience with tribes and sport fishing. I lived and worked in Billings, MT for 4 years in the 70's. Billings is 150-200 miles from the blue ribbon rivers, Madison, upper Yellowstone etc, too far for a day trip. But we had the Big Horn about 70 miles SE of Billings. I don't know what it is like now but back then it was a tremendous tailwater fishery below Yellowtail Dam for 15 miles or so. Big nasty Browns and Rainbows. It was all on the Crow Reservation. You had to buy a tribal permit which was, I think, 20 bucks a year. I fished there so much, all CNR, that I got to know the tribal cop that checked my permit.

In Spring, the last year I lived there, the tribal cop told me the reservation would prob close the river to all fishing. I asked him why and he said "AIM has the young bucks all stirred up". AIM was the American Indian Movement. If you know anything about the 70's, you know who AIM was. It was at the same time as Billy Frank, Boldt etc around here, very activist time.

So they closed the Big Horn that summer. No reason to do that, The tribes didn't sport fish, no commercial fishing, they never allowed camping on the Res, no wild beer parties, no vandalism just a few guys fishing. They just plain did not like us and wanted us off their land. This smells like the same thing to me. The tribes love to take our money at their casinos, but they don't really like us.

If that sounds racial to you, It's not.

[jonb]

I certainly agree with stopping the rough and racial talk. But I also think we are at a crossroads. I didn't believe it at first but I really think the tribes want us off the water particularly the salt and the south sound rivers. I'm 72 and I've had 60 years of great salmon/steelhead fishing. You younger guys have more to lose than me.

This all reminds me of my previous experience with tribes and sport fishing. I lived and worked in Billings, MT for 4 years in the 70's. Billings is 150-200 miles from the blue ribbon rivers, Madison, upper Yellowstone etc, too far for a day trip. But we had the Big Horn about 70 miles SE of Billings. I don't know what it is like now but back then it was a tremendous tailwater fishery below Yellowtail Dam for 15 miles or so. Big nasty Browns and Rainbows. It was all on the Crow Reservation. You had to buy a tribal permit which was, I think, 20 bucks a year. I fished there so much, all CNR, that I got to know the tribal cop that checked my permit.

In Spring, the last year I lived there, the tribal cop told me the reservation would prob close the river to all fishing. I asked him why and he said "AIM has the young bucks all stirred up". AIM was the American Indian Movement. If you know anything about the 70's, you know who AIM was. It was at the same time as Billy Frank, Boldt etc around here, very activist time.

So they closed the Big Horn that summer. No reason to do that, The tribes didn't sport fish, no commercial fishing, they never allowed camping on the Res, no wild beer parties, no vandalism just a few guys fishing. They just plain did not like us and wanted us off their land. This smells like the same thing to me. The tribes love to take our money at their casinos, but they don't really like us.

If that sounds racial to you, It's not.

Sounds about right, our ancestors came in and killed the natives at near genocide levels and stole everything they had. why wouldn't they dislike us? Of coarse they dont like us. To them we are still taking "their fish". I dont agree with that line of thought, i think as a planet the resources should be shared amongst all of us. It shouldnt be us vs them, its us and us 1 human race. (im a democratic socialist incase you couldnt tell)
The point is, if we fight them and dont compromise, it will ALWAYS be us vs them, there will always be anomosity. At some point we will have to make a compromise of some sort to bury the hatchet. The worst thing we could do is A.) illegally protest fish B.) use ignorant racial rhetoric and C.) support donald trump (joking ) those actions will only entrench the battle lines and make it worse. Maybe if we compromise for the sake of conservstion, perhaps they would too. Diplomacy is the only way there though.

[BARCHASER10]

That's just not the way things are in the USofA. Its like the 60's and the 70's. Not so much a country but more like a collection of powerful special interest groups who can only think about fighting each other and "winning". Compromise isn't viewed as a virtue, its considered a weakness. I've been around for awhile but I've never seen it this bad, even back in the day.

I don't like it either, but it is what it is.

The Tribes are just copying everything else that goes on these days. If the Tribes win and I think they will, they'll toss us a bone now and then, some token salmon fisheries, but that's about it. In their view, they do not have to compromise. The law, money, politics and probably public opinion are on their side.

I feel sorry for folks like the Mason Family who bought Olsons Resort in Sekiu a few years ago. Olsons had gotten really run down. The Mason Family spent a lot of bucks buying the place and fixing it up. Now fishing is closed there. Now what? Looks kinda grim for them. They way it looks to me, the Sekiu fishing resorts will likely close up, just a memory. You've prob never been there so you don't give a hoot.

[jonb]

That's just not the way things are in the USofA. Its like the 60's and the 70's. Not so much a country but more like a collection of powerful special interest groups who can only think about fighting each other and "winning". Compromise isn't viewed as a virtue, its considered a weakness. I've been around for awhile but I've never seen it this bad, even back in the day.

I don't like it either, but it is what it is.

The Tribes are just copying everything else that goes on these days. If the Tribes win and I think they will, they'll toss us a bone now and then, some token salmon fisheries, but that's about it. In their view, they do not have to compromise. The law, money, politics and probably public opinion are on their side.

I feel sorry for folks like the Mason Family who bought Olsons Resort in Sekiu a few years ago. Olsons had gotten really run down. The Mason Family spent a lot of bucks buying the place and fixing it up. Now fishing is closed there. Now what? Looks kinda grim for them. They way it looks to me, the Sekiu fishing resorts will likely close up, just a memory. You've prob never been there so you don't give a hoot.

Well you've nailed why unfettered chronie capitalism doesn't work as it is in the US.

That is a big part why i chose canada. You should see how small business flourishes here, despite right wing anto socialist rhetoric in the states. Its not marxism and its not free market vulture capitalism. Its a nice compromise between the two. Like most things in life, moderation is key.

If that no compromise attitude continues too long there wont be any salmon left for anyone in washington before too long.

[Goldrigger1]

Good discussion. I like ideas presented intelligently. Makes me want to come back.

We whites sure ripped of the Indians when we had the chance. They deserve a break. However, the little guy in this drama is the fish and the rec. fisherman who has no big organized voice. I think we will fight like crazy to hold onto the great recreation we have now as the population increases.

Wish we had time machines so I could fish these rivers in the 1960s.

[dj2loud]

When did Danny state this ???



Danny Stonedahl, the Bellingham, Washington-based Guide/Owner of the River Chrome Guide Service, a Puget Sound and Olympic Peninsula salmon and steelhead fishing guide company, reduces tribal fishing rights to a matter of skin color in the context of attacking tribal fishing.[20]


Danny Stonedahl The fishery is discriminatory. The tribe is fishing and allowed to fish because of the color of their skin, yet we cannot. This isnt (sic) fair, to us or this fish. This fishery doesnt (sic) promote equality is the point, it makes things so much worse and im (sic) glad they are reporting on this disgusting event.


???????????????

[G-Man]

I can say with certainty, there are people on all sides of the situation who haven't a care in the world about the state of our native salmon/fish population and simply do what they please. These are the people who maintain the rift between the tribes, commericals and the sport fishermen. I used to think enforcement, or lack thereof, by both Tribal and State officials was to blame. I've come to learn that there are "bad" people in every every community and no threat of punishment or level of enforcement will deter their actions. Until we are all just one community, these unscrupulous individuals will continue to keep us at each other's throats, which in the end only hurts those who do care, and of course the native fish populations.