Chironomids, chironomids, and more chironomids...

[kutthroatkilla]

I doubt I could teach anything you don't already know. I'm always up for a good time fishing...feel free to drop me a PM anytime and we'll see if we can hook up sometime. Heck, anyone for that matter...I'll fish with whoever wants to fish. :-D


Chad

+++

Hey Chad, no I bet I could probably could learn from you! I'm just picking up the sport in earnest and am certaintly no expert at all. I'll PM you and maybe we can fish the Cedar River or Rattlesnake Lake in the next few weeks.

I have given you slack in the past, and I forgive you so I will do it in the future again. I really think you would do better.

Angler - that's cool dude, I understand where you're coming from. If you don't like me saying "IMHO" then so what...we have our differences. I really don't mind that you seem annoyed by some of my posts, or as you say "giving me slack" cause that's bound to happen. Not really sure what to make of your post there, but I don't care anyways. Moving on...let's talk CHIRONOMIDS and get back on track. What's your favorite color chronie? I believe maroon is one of the best! KTK

[leahcim_dahc]

...

Thank you. I kinda figured it may have been a misinterpretation of what was actually meant.


Chad

[Marc Martyn]

Perhaps the most intriguing thing about fly fishing is figuring it out:scratch: True, I have been at this game for many years and I have come to the conclusion that I may get a grasp on the relationship between a trout and an insect about the time I will be too old to chase them anymore. There are so many variables in this sport it is unbelievable. The different ecosystems of lakes that are even close together varies greatly. You can fish West Medical with one fly successfully and go over to Medical an hour later and fish the same fly with no success. Fly fishing for trout is truly mysterious at times. That is what keeps me going back for more. Bait fishing is not the same. Either they want the power bait or not.

Each time I get a chance to talk with someone at a lake about fly fishing I learn something new. Many of the people on the water will share their information freely. Certain people have devoted time to different aspects of fly fishing. Some have studied damsels, others have studied chironomids. Sharing your information with others and them sharing with you is how all of us will, maybe, someday understand the complete world of the trout.:thumright

[Rooscooter]

Anglinarcher,
I also guided out of Sun Valley when I was 17 and 18 (1981 and 82). I was an assistant to Snug's shop in Sun Valley. I too remember going to Silver Creek and the "Wood" with some pretty self important people. Although, I didn't see any wine or cheese!

That just brought back some memories.


Tight Lines!!

[kutthroatkilla]

Each time I get a chance to talk with someone at a lake about fly fishing I learn something new. Many of the people on the water will share their information freely. Certain people have devoted time to different aspects of fly fishing. Some have studied damsels, others have studied chironomids. Sharing your information with others and them sharing with you is how all of us will, maybe, someday understand the complete world of the trout.:thumright

1. And not just the trout...but all species of fish.
2. Your spot on. Everytime I go out other fly-fishermen/women are always willing to suggest patterns for a particular area new to me. I'm forever grateful for their contributions and helping me out. I believe sharing information is one of the fundamental ways in which we can advance this "science" and hobby, and truly pass it on from generation to generation.

KTK

[chironomid_guy]

When Im "still fishing" with a chironny, I change up my fly fairly often. Every couple of fish (or if the fishing slows down) get their throat pumped and then released. The chironnys that are hatching can change color very quickly. I find carrying a small sample jar works well to purge the throat sample into so I can evaluate what size and color will work the best. The reason I purge the throat area is that those chironnys are the last ones the trout ate, so matching the color and size is easier than the chironnys he ate 10 minutes ago. Cheers

[leahcim_dahc]

Good tip! Thank you!

I have hesitated pumping the throats for fear of harming the fish. However, I am thinking next time I'm out, I will hit the docks first and talk someone who is taking fish home and pump their throats. In the off chance I do it wrong, the fish is headed to a freezer anyway.


Chad

[Anglinarcher]

Anglinarcher,
I also guided out of Sun Valley when I was 17 and 18 (1981 and 82). I was an assistant to Snug's shop in Sun Valley. I too remember going to Silver Creek and the "Wood" with some pretty self important people. Although, I didn't see any wine or cheese!

That just brought back some memories.


Tight Lines!!

"I didn't see any wine or cheese!" LOL, neither did they, I was too young for the wine.

I was with Wood River Outfitters, and it was the mid 70's. Great place to fish, kind of miss the old place. Have you been back to the Taylor Bear Tracks area of the Big Wood lately?

Oh, yea, back to blood worms. I kind of keep some of each color around. I play around with droppers some time, each with a different color, and try to let the fish tell me what to use. I prefer to rib mine with copper wire instead of the silvers or golds, but it only seems to work better in hard hit waters.

[Anglinarcher]

Good tip! Thank you!

I have hesitated pumping the throats for fear of harming the fish. However, I am thinking next time I'm out, I will hit the docks first and talk someone who is taking fish home and pump their throats. In the off chance I do it wrong, the fish is headed to a freezer anyway.


Chad

You know, you have me thinking here. I have a pump, and have had for probably 20+ years. In all of those years I have used it maybe a dozen times.

I use to use it to suck the stomach/throat contents, but deterimined that this was not good. Then I filled the pump and gently forced water into the throat to bring recently eaten food up. This seemed better, and is probably alright, but..............

Other than a post I read on this site a while back, just how bad is a properly used stomach pump on fish? I guess that is why I have used mine so seldom, I just don't know...........................

[leahcim_dahc]

You know, you have me thinking here. I have a pump, and have had for probably 20+ years. In all of those years I have used it maybe a dozen times.

I use to use it to suck the stomach/throat contents, but deterimined that this was not good. Then I filled the pump and gently forced water into the throat to bring recently eaten food up. This seemed better, and is probably alright, but..............

Other than a post I read on this site a while back, just how bad is a properly used stomach pump on fish? I guess that is why I have used mine so seldom, I just don't know...........................

I did read that post a while back and that is what has prompted me to hold off for just a bit on pumping throats. I was reading an article about a week ago regarding chironomid tactics by Brian Chan...he stated care should be taken so the fish isn't harmed. He didn't elaborate or go into details on the proper way to do it, but reading the instructions included with the throat pump says to operate it in the same manner you described. I think what may cause death would be inexperienced people using it as a stomach pump instead of throat pump. I don't think you need to completely insert the pump into the stomach to obtain samples. The pump may be inserted into the stomach and then the bulb squeezed possibly bursting the fishes stomach, or the tapered edges might not be tapered enough causing tears in the esophagus, the bulb is released too early and damage is done to the stomach and/or esophagus.

The proper use of a throat pump samples the esophagus or throat of the fish, where the food items are still alive. The fish can then be released alive. However, improper use of the tool can damage or even kill a fish, so take care.

http://www.flyfishersrepublic.com/tacti ... d-tactics/
http://www.rp3fishingadventures.com/fly ... on-a-fish/


Chad

[chironomid_guy]

The mentor speaks gospel............. Brian is absolutely correct. You dont need to know what the fish ate a while ago, only what they just ate. Being careful not to injure the fish naturally.

I use throat samples all the time, and you will find that the color and size of the chironomids will change as the day progresses. Have fun, keep a journal or log which includes all the pertenant info on each lake (weather, water temp, injested inverts, hatches etc). The journal will become invaluable over time as you use it as a reference guide. I have found that over the years (I'm not that old ... lol), that certain events trigger hatches and you will find patterns over time. An example of that is that I have found that we need (at least in my neck of the woods) 3 days of 80 degree weather to trigger a flying ant hatch at my elevation. That info then translates into the fact that high elevation lakes will have an ant hatch in the near future and I can make plans to fish them (armed appropriately with ant patterns of course). If you pay attention to whats going around you (the water as welll as everywhere else), it can pay in spades. Aldo Leopold's writings reflect this if your interested in researching it further. TTFN

Cheers

[Anglinarcher]

.......3 days of 80 degree weather to trigger a flying ant hatch at my elevation. That info then translates ........................

So, this year that means we may not get flying ants??????????????????????

LOL

[chironomid_guy]

Appearantly not in your neck of the woods anglin............ we already had ours......... roflmao.

Cheers

[Anglinarcher]

Appearantly not in your neck of the woods anglin............ we already had ours......... roflmao.

Cheers

Stop rubbing it in. I fished a favorite lake this last Saturday, a lake my fishing logs show has had surface temperatures in the low to mid 60's by this time every year for the last 4 years I have recorded, and this week, it was


53 lousey degrees.

[leahcim_dahc]

The mentor speaks gospel............. Brian is absolutely correct. You dont need to know what the fish ate a while ago, only what they just ate. Being careful not to injure the fish naturally.

I use throat samples all the time, and you will find that the color and size of the chironomids will change as the day progresses. Have fun, keep a journal or log which includes all the pertenant info on each lake (weather, water temp, injested inverts, hatches etc). The journal will become invaluable over time as you use it as a reference guide. I have found that over the years (I'm not that old ... lol), that certain events trigger hatches and you will find patterns over time. An example of that is that I have found that we need (at least in my neck of the woods) 3 days of 80 degree weather to trigger a flying ant hatch at my elevation. That info then translates into the fact that high elevation lakes will have an ant hatch in the near future and I can make plans to fish them (armed appropriately with ant patterns of course). If you pay attention to whats going around you (the water as welll as everywhere else), it can pay in spades. Aldo Leopold's writings reflect this if your interested in researching it further. TTFN

Cheers

I'm always up for reading some good material. I googled the name and come up with a couple books. Any of them you recommend?

http://gargravarr.cc.utexas.edu/chrisj/ ... ogical-edu