Northwest Fishing Reports

I am connected to a site that monitors fishing in the US. They notified me about HB 2241. I have sent the following to my State Representatives.

I propose that it would be worth your time to respond as well.

As an angler and a conservationist, I am writing to oppose HB 2241, the proposed statewide ban on certain lead fishing tackle. Should these severe and unwarranted regulations on fishing tackle containing lead pass there will be a significant negative impact on Washington's anglers and our fisheries resources. In spite of a lack of evidence and over the objections of anglers, the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) recently approved a ban on lead fishing tackle on the 13 lakes where loons breed in Washington. Though advocates for the ban said that such ban satisfied their concerns, they are now seeking a statewide ban.

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has consistently rejected petitions to ban all lead in fishing tackle across the U.S., stating that such a ban is not "necessary to protect against an unreasonable risk of injury to health or the environment." The proposed ban in HB 2241 is even less justified. Advocates of the proposed regulations have only cited nine loon deaths from lead toxicosis over a 13 year period in Washington state. In fact, according to the WDFW, loon populations in Washington are increasing. Loons are much more negatively impacted by threats such as shoreline development, domestic and wild predators and disease than lead fishing tackle. It is unreasonable to impose a biologically unjustified law that will significantly impact recreational anglers, but have a negligible impact on the growing loon populations that it seeks to protect. Fish and wildlife management decisions should be made on scientific fact, not emotion.

Instead of imposing burdensome and severe regulations, the WDFW should work with anglers to help us better understand any angler-loon interactions and provide opportunities for anglers to become involved in ongoing loon conservation programs that require volunteer help.

I urge you to oppose HB 2241.

Thank you very much for your consideration.

I thought it was already passed and in effect as of July or some such time/date, for those lakes. And yes we all knew the ban people would try to cover the whole state, then the whole country sooner or later.

Even the WDFW says the info on loon deaths doesn't warrent a regulation against lead sinker use.

It was passed for the 13 lakes, now this bill wants to make it state wide.

If we don't act, then it is not even reasonable to consider the impact on or fishing. Every jig we have will not be legal, most lures have lead weights in them, and it goes on and on and on.

I dont see the problem with it. Lead it a bad substance.

Another "feel good" law that dosent hurt anyone but the people who fish. The Greeners always go after the easy targets. You think for one moment they would take on real estate and land developers? Nope. Hit the pople who have no lobbists to protect them.

Seriously? They gonna ban it in the rivers too? Where's the info coming from, I'd like to read it. News story, links or something... That's just retarded.

dogfish4pan wrote:Another "feel good" law that dosent hurt anyone but the people who fish. The Greeners always go after the easy targets. You think for one moment they would take on real estate and land developers? Nope. Hit the pople who have no lobbists to protect them.

So I've been noticing you posting on quite a few threads and I'm beginning to question whether you are even are interested in fishing. Noting your grammatical patterns and choices of words I can tell you are a rather uneducated malcontent. My next thought is you are probably having tofu and sprouts for dinner, you haven’t bathed in several days and your career choice is to beg for signatures on initiatives for a fixed fee because you are not really a contributing member of society, just a leach. My suggestion is for you to go troll someplace else, this is not a good forum to "occupy".

at Bodo

sickbayer wrote:I dont see the problem with it. Lead it a bad substance.

Really, is it? Did you know that most of the city water/drinking water lines in the Eastern US, and in Seattle, are lead? You seem to be doing OK. Yes, the new lines are being upgraded, but all of the old lines are lead.

Did you know that lead is naturally occurring in every natural environment?

Did you know that lead precipitates out of a solution very easily, so it tends to settle to the bottom and does little to habitat. Only if it is ingested, where it is ground and then dissolved by an acid, does it cause problems?

Let's talk other dangerous substances, like water. Far more people die from drowning then from lead. No studies have been done on animals to date, but I suspect that air breathing animals die from that "bad substance" all the time. Should we outlaw water?

Oxygen is a "bad substance". It will cause fire to burn out of control. In too great a concentration, it causes other things to be explosive. Should we outlaw it as well?

Obviously the point of this is that in low enough concentrations, most "bad substances" are not bad at all. The science marginally supported the ban of lead shot for shooting migratory waterfowl. The jury is still out on the success of that, with far more ducks and geese dying from crippling steel shot hits then from lead poisoning. Still, other non-game species have shown some marginal improvements.

In the case of loons, and in the case of a general lead ban for fishing, the science does not support the ban at all. As dogfish4pan correctly stated, this is a feel good law only, serving no scientific purpose at all.

So, Sickbayer and Bodofish, what do you propose we substitute for lead? Or, do you plan on not fishing anymore???

Oh, and to both of you, who is the uneducated malcontent? What is your education level, and did you graduate with the same feel good teachers that passed you on so it did not hurt your feelings?

I see that dogfish4pan has three posts, and you think you can determine his motives and qualifications from that? I see nothing wrong with his sentence structure, grammar, or content in this post.

By the way, don't even think of questioning my education. From the post I have seen from you two jokers the last few years, I suspect I double your achievements, real world and academic.

Still, I would like to think in some way we can still be friends. Contact your representatives to express your feelings. If you agree with me, great; if you do not agree with me, then so be it.

I have seen this all over the web and have written and sent my letter, as well. This ban would have SERIOUS impacts on sport fishing in our state and river fisherman and bass anglers would likely take the biggest hit. Sickbayer, we are talking NO pencil lead, NO sliky's, NO weighted bobbers, NO bullet weights or slip weights, NO jig heads (steallhead, bass, bottomfish, all inclusive), NO leadcore trolling lines, etc etc etc. Another scary thought is allowing this ban would likely open the door for further legislation in the future, namely banning dowrigger balls!! There are other alternatives used for making slip weights/etc but they are overly large in size, and making 1/16th oz steelhead jigs from steel is just not an option here. Without pencil lead/slinkys, river fishing as we know it would forever change. The list goes on and on, this is very serious and would have very serious implications on all recreational fishers in our state. As stated, there is little/no hard science to support the need for this decision and unless they can PROVE beyond a reasonable doubt that lead is killing fish or avian species (and more specifically ESA listed populations of concern) through scientific documentation they really have no right to enact such blanket legislation.

I searched high and low for a lead alternative for downrigger balls. There is a plastic "Planer" thing, but don't know much about it's abilities. When I first read through the bill, I will admit that I take an opinion of, " Come on sportsman, there are tons of alternative sinkers available" Brass, steel, Bismuth shot, tungsten, etc. I would be happy to buy these alternative weights.
Matt mentioned DR balls, and lead core line bans, etc. I am not sure what could be done to develop these items in a non-toxic manner. Somehow I always tell myself that if we can send people to the moon we should be able to develop relatively simply technology such as this.
It is a tough situation when Govt. wants to step in and make a change that hits the individual right in an area where they/WE live.... this time fishing. Suddenly when I could not find alternatives to my lead DR balls, I got a little worked up, and called bs on the ban. (Suddenly this ban might effect ME)
This will then bring up all the discussion of if they start banning split shot, then it will be something bigger, and eventually it will creep up to a complete ban on fishing..... just look at Peta's campain regarding banning fishing altogether, LOL.

So what is my point? I would be happy with being told to switch to any of these alternative sinker/weights, because they are readily available. Ya,they cost more.. so what. I would not want to see a ban on things that there don't seem to be alternatives to, i.e. downrigger balls. Why not just make a steel ball, sure it is prob. expensive and right now it would not compete against lead prices.... (Actually has anyone bought a lead DR ball in the past year? They've gone way up!)

The real point to me is that we all are cool with whatever..... until it hits us personally. Even my Eco/green ***, once I saw it effecting my DR balls, I wanted to shoot the whole thing down. I wish as much effort went into law enforcement of how people abuse the waterways with all the general trash. I have to believe that much more damage is done to wildlife/enviroment from just plain trash,etc. I feel literally like take an arm off of any person found dropping their garbage along rivers and lakes. My .02

see for yourself: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=2241" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

targets retailers first. buried in there with mercury. specifies fishing weights 1" or smaller?????

Amx wrote:I thought it was already passed and in effect as of July or some such time/date, for those lakes. And yes we all knew the ban people would try to cover the whole state, then the whole country sooner or later.

Even the WDFW says the info on loon deaths doesn't warrent a regulation against lead sinker use.

Pierre Lake Stevens County was under the lead weight ban last winter.

Yea, I was the first to understand the ramifications of the deal. Lead is very dense and malleable, making it heavier in a smaller package. When My brother came back from New York, he brought a bunch of the tungsten sinkers, and steel sinkers and other garbage. I hated it. Probably almost broke a tooth on it. Find a metal that's works like that! Gold, silver maybe? All the other heavy metals are significantly more expensive and dangerous. Some birds eat the little split shot. But find me a bird that'll swallow 2 inches of quarter inch stick lead and I'll show you a species that deserves extinction.

natetreat wrote: find me a bird that'll swallow 2 inches of quarter inch stick lead and I'll show you a species that deserves extinction.

Hilarious! LOL

14 (13) "Wholesaler" means a wholesaler of a mercury-added or
15 prohibited lead product.
16 (14) "Prohibited lead product" includes both of the following, but
17 excludes any product being used for the purposes of commercial fishing:
18 (a) Lead weighted fishing hook with the lead portion having a mass
19 of one ounce or less or a size of less than one inch along its shortest
20 axis; and
21 (b) Fishing sinker containing more than one-half of one percent
22 lead by weight if the lead portion of the sinker has a mass of one
23 ounce or less or a size of less than one inch along its shortest axis

"a size of less than one inch along its shortest axis" .... This would include all pencil lead and many/all "banana weights".

I have never seen a jig molded of anything but lead. You could mold tin, but the size is much larger. So, how many of you use jigs for perch or bass or steel head?

There are wire fishing lines, but you now need new fishing rods with roller guides.

A lot of us use weighted hooks for swim baits, they would be gone.

IF there was science to back up this ban, then OK -there is none..

The use of the term "or" in the regulation is startling as well, as is the fact that it state "less than 1" on its smallest axis". Pretty much every piece of lead used for fishing has 1 axis smaller than 1", even a 2" chunk of pencil lead is only 1/4" thick.... and downrigger balls have fins that are 1/4" wide. This needs to be thought out, studied, and well planned before being made into law. I am not against lead RESTRICTIONS but universal bans for the state seem asinine.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Here's the link I just used to ask my reps to "kill the bill, 2241". It's very easy to use. It contacted all 3 of my state reps, state house and senate.
They are trying to "back door" cram this up our sphincters by banning retailers from selling it rather than utilizing WDFW to ban its use.
Good point Matt on the DR balls fin being less than 1". I didn't catch that.

They are also using a basic "Art of War" tactic of "Divide then conquer". Targeting just "sports" or recreational fishermen. Ensuring commercial fishing interests don't enter the battle, openly excluding ammunition so they don't butt heads with the NRA either. Until later that is!