Fishy myths?

[platinumroof]

I have heard so many times that sunfish will eat bass eggs if you take the bass off of it's bed. Is this really common? I have done some bed fishing and have never seen a sunfish move onto a bed. I wonder if it is one of those things that people hear and repeat but have never actually witnessed. Like: "bass crush plastic lizards because salamaders eat their eggs" (I've never even seen a salamander in the water let alone near a bed) or "fish a windy bank because the baitfish get pushed up on it" (pushed up? Their tails don't work? If baitfish can't outswim windblown current wouldn't they all be up on the bank in piles?)
So has anyone ever seen a sunfish raid a bed that the bass was taken off of? Got any other suspicious sayings?

[kevinb]

Good question...my guess would be the body of water and population of the sunfish. I havn't seen it happen either but some of the lakes I hit I wouldn't be able to see them do it,do to stained water.

[kevinb]

Someone will probably get their panties in a riff. But when I'm bass fishing,I try to release them ASAP. I'm not sure if the damage would be done by the sunfish by then or not....

[platinumroof]

Where I have bed fished it is very clear water and there are a lot of pumkinseed. I've noticed that after the bass are done spawning the sunfish show up and spawn in the same areas. I can't say that the sunfish don't raid beds when the fish are removed for extended periods during tournaments but I can say that they don't move onto the bed when the fish is caught and released immediately.
I don't have a strong opinion either way about sight fishing for bedded fish. It isn't my favorite way to catch them but I did teach myself how to do it so I can if I need to.

[fishaholictaz]

Most of these are based in other areas. One of those I can answer is the bait fish being pushed by the wind. The wind doesn't push the bait it pushes what the bait is feeding on so it seems that the wind is moving the schools.

I have seen some different things about salamanders and sunfish raiding beds and imagine that there is some locations where it happens.As far as around here I have seen bass defending there beds from perch!

[platinumroof]

So when you saw the bass defending against perch do you think the perch were trying to raid the nest or just were getting too close?
I imagine that there must be some sort of predation on eggs or the bass wouldn't be so defensive about intruders into the bed. I have read on another site that guys had witnessed big carp wiping out a bed and the bass couldn't do a thing about it.
I still doubt that catch and release presents much of an opportunity for predation by sunfish or perch.
I agree with taz that the baitfish are attracted to the windblown areas. It is just kind of funny how many people refer to it as being pushed by the wind. It seems like they are repeating what they have heard without really thinking about the logic of it. That's what got me started on this topic. I've heard it so many times about how sunfish will move in within minutes and wipe out a bed but no one I know has ever seen it.

[fishaholictaz]

It would take a lot of pan fish to raid a whole nest! I could see any fish almost trying to get an easy meal off fresh bass eggs but who knows.
But I do agree that the 10 minutes that she is off the nest isn't going to let all the eggs get eaten but it is possible that the nest may be a few short when mama comes back.
I saw the perch coming up and trying to grab eggs.

[tnj8222]

after you catch a fish off the bed it doesnt go right back into attack mode. it will sit back and might not even go back to the bed right then. giving the panfish alot more time to get in there. chances are the bass that was just released wouldnt even attack a panfish on its bed until it calms. but this would be just more heresay since i havent seen it myself just been told this by people who have been bass fishing much longer than myself.

[kzoo]

It definitely strains the bass after it's been caught. Spawning bass don't fight as well as prespawn and summer fish. As for panfish moving in, I fish a lake up in Michigan every year for the spawning smallies. We definitely know when they're finished with the spawn, rock bass will move on their beds. I think the rock bass move in just to finish the rest of the eggs off. These rock bass will be on the bed pretty fast, which makes me wonder if they're that close to the bed at all times.

[Smalma]

Here in Washington I would worry too much about sunfish raiding an un-guarded nest. They genreally do not become real active in the shallows until the water warms a bit more.

However sunfish are not the only potential predator of the bass eggs. In addition to the all ready mentioned yellow pernch most of our western Washington waters have populations of sculpins that would love a meal of bass eggs. Othe potential predators are also in most of our waters including crappies, brown bullheads, trout, etc.

Something to think about "why do the males guard the nest?" I think that we all know the answer to that question so we know that not having the males doing their job most have an impact on the egg survival.

Another factor that has not been mentioned is that the male largemouth will guard the young fry for a time. When the fry first hatch he keeps them in the nest and as they get to be stronger swimmers he attempts to keep the herded in a school. This protection gives the young fry a little more of a head start in the survival game. With the male doing his duty those fry quickly scatter and as individuals are more vulunerable.

Lastly it has been implied that a caught male is only a way from the bed for a brief period. That is true except for the all to common case of the folks putting the fish in their live wells for a later photo opportunity, for a tourament weigh-in and just a grin and release at the boat launch. Any action such as these dooms any eggs/fry in the vacated bed.

Tight lines
Curt

[Jay S]

I fish a fairly shallow lake (25 feet at the deepest point) on the eastside a lot and have seen bass bedded by the launch. The launch also gets a ton of pressure because it is one of the only places people with no boats can fish publicly. One time on the lake I seen a kid catch a bedded bass and keep it. I checked this place on the way in later in the day to see if any other bass or fish had moved into the area and there was nothing but the bed. I was fishing the same lake the next day and the area the bass had been bedded in was over run with a school of sunfish. So I would say once they figure out the bass isn’t coming back they move in on the area and take advantage of the unprotected nest. I think they will watch the area before they try to invade. Think of it like they are little crooks waiting for you to go on vacation once they notice you’re gone all day they wait for nighttime or the perfect opportunity and raid the fridge so to speak. I would have to say the salamander thing is true but only a certain time in the year and that would be a short time after the hatch. I have never seen a salamander on a bed but have encountered them in the water in ponds and around the water. Ever heard of water dogs? I read somewhere once in a turkey hunting article (turkey hunting can be around the same time as the spawn in some areas) that a couple guys were going into the woods at dark and they heard what sounded like deer walking. So the turned on their flash lights and didn’t see any deer but continued to hear the sound. When one of them looked down they saw hundreds of salamanders all over the ground scattering. It mentioned he had researched this and that it had something to do with the hatch of the salamanders and they were hunting next to a pond he believed they came from. Again that was just some thing I read and have never experienced my self.

[kevinb]

Good info everyone. I don't want to start a huge debate. I'm wondering with some of the info.given. Should I not bass fish during spawn and even awhile into post-spawn? I'm not a great bass angler,but enjoy the fishery very much. I wouldn't want to damage it. Any thoughts?:-k

[Jay S]

I think its ok as long as you practice catch and release and if you do want to keep fish to eat only keep smaller ones as long as they are legal of course. They’re better eating any way. Nothing is worse then keeping illegal fish. P.S. If you’re looking for good table fair perch are far better tasting in my opinion and easy to catch.

[kevinb]

I think its ok as long as you practice catch and release and if you do want to keep fish to eat only keep smaller ones as long as they are legal of course. They’re better eating any way. Nothing is worse then keeping illegal fish. P.S. If you’re looking for good table fair perch are far better tasting in my opinion and easy to catch.

Thanks,good to know on the info.
I always C&R the bass.

[eustace]

As stated above I think most of your pan fish just like to spawn in the same areas as the Bass, so the thinking there raiding the bass beds begins. I think most all predortation is soon after the hatch. In some lakes in eastern washing you can see the Blue Gill and Bass gaurding beds within a few feet from each other. I have turtles are the biggest nest raiders.

As far as carp go I have seen them destroy an entire area through there crazy, thrashing, splashing spawning activity. They are destructive but not as to purposly do so. That is when spearing for them is easiest. spearing carp or archery for them is a blast.

[A9]

kevinb: Fishing beds during the spawn is a decision that varies from angler to angler, cause it's an ethical decision...I don't fish for bass more then 20 times per year. Most of the time it's just evenings at my favorite smallie spot enjoying a nice summer evening. So I'm maybe fishing on beds two or three times per year. In my situation, I'm OK with catching a few off beds, taking a quick picture and sticking em back in the water close to their beds. If I was fishing for bass A LOT, I'd probably limit it because continuously picking fish off beds will have some downsides to it, as previously mentioned, but nothing too serious

[kevinb]

As stated above I think most of your pan fish just like to spawn in the same areas as the Bass, so the thinking there raiding the bass beds begins. I think most all predortation is soon after the hatch. In some lakes in eastern washing you can see the Blue Gill and Bass gaurding beds within a few feet from each other. I have turtles are the biggest nest raiders.

As far as carp go I have seen them destroy an entire area through there crazy, thrashing, splashing spawning activity. They are destructive but not as to purposly do so. That is when spearing for them is easiest. spearing carp or archery for them is a blast.

Thanks again. I fish bass anytime of year along with other species. I C&R as fast as possible,I've never targeted a bed however in some of my spots it would be hard to know. Lake Tapps is loaded with carp too and I sure don't want those guys getting an easy meal off smallies because of me.

[fishaholictaz]

A few years ago a guy came through my favorite lake and was seen 5 days out all day pulling bass off their beds and taking them! This is just wrong and if you have any care for the sport and you fish beds take a picture and turn them loose as soon as possible because you never know what is going to happen and those eggs are the future of our sport!

It isn't that cool in my opinion to catch a fish off a bed it doesn't show that you are a good fisherman no matter how big the fish is

[tnj8222]

bed fishing threads always go downhill. many many many bass are pulled off beds every year. just take clear lake for instance. a huge amount of tournys are held and lots of those bass will come off beds. i dont see that fishery in any trouble at all.

[eustace]

As stated above I think most of your pan fish just like to spawn in the same areas as the Bass, so the thinking there raiding the bass beds begins. I think most all predortation is soon after the hatch. In some lakes in eastern washing you can see the Blue Gill and Bass gaurding beds within a few feet from each other. I have turtles are the biggest nest raiders.

As far as carp go I have seen them destroy an entire area through there crazy, thrashing, splashing spawning activity. They are destructive but not as to purposly do so. That is when spearing for them is easiest. spearing carp or archery for them is a blast.

Thanks again. I fish bass anytime of year along with other species. I C&R as fast as possible,I've never targeted a bed however in some of my spots it would be hard to know. Lake Tapps is loaded with carp too and I sure don't want those guys getting an easy meal off smallies because of me.

Kevinb, carp are almost exclusively vegaterian. What I am trying to say is they are destructive just in spawning activities. Although I have caught a carp on worm, I don't think they purposely target bass eggs or worms.